Rob Hahn is the prognosticator of the real estate industry. A few weeks back on Brokerage Insider, he discussed how teams are the biggest threat to the brokerage industry. This week Rob discussed the big news that Zillow decided to become a real estate brokerage AND that they will stop accepting feeds and instead just get IDX data from MLSs. Listen to what Rob thinks.
Or in the explode virtual conference on Thursday, September 24th. We look forward to returning to our regular schedule program soon, but until then, enjoy this session. In this episode, I interview Rob Hahn, managing partner of 7DS and Associates and prognosticator of the real estate industry.
Eric Stegemann: And so, you know, Rob, I actually wrote up a whole bunch of questions before yesterday morning to talk to you about. Sure. And I kind of threw them in the trash can and started after the Zellers news. Yeah, after the big announcement. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, and I mentioned this morning when we talked to David Gulper, and I’ll just reiterate it for anybody that was not in the track this morning, but to announce that they are starting a brokerage officially, even though they had real estate licenses for a while, their official start markets are in Tucson, Phoenix and Atlanta. And so they’re going to start up a brokerage, but particularly two things of note. Number one is they’re going to focus their brokerage on just their home buying process. And number two is they’re moving away from fees where they accept fees and going straight to index data directly from all of your analysis. So let’s talk about Zillow homes for just a second. They are going to have salary based agents. Right. And, you know, on a scale of one to 10, considering last time one of our big topics when we talked on the last show of Brokerage Insider, so we talked about it and you said Zillow is not the biggest threat to brokerages. Let me first ask you, do you think that’s changed at all? Like if you had to give a scale of one to 10, where did you think they were before yesterday and where do you think they are now? I’d say probably before yesterday.
Rob Hahn: They’re probably three. And today there are three. I don’t I don’t think anything has changed, you know, and I think I made this point in my latest post about this, you know, that I just put up yesterday as a reaction. People are like Zillow is a competitor and yadda, yadda. I’m like, look, unless you’ve got a couple billion dollars of investor money and they don’t care about losing it for 10 years, you’re not a competitor. Like, that’s not you know, that’s not what their business is. And I guess the way I look at it is I mean, for because this is a brokerage group like do you think open doors, a competitor. Because this is the same thing, right? They have billions of dollars, they’re going to go in and pay cash for a house they’re using, they’re in house employee agents to do it. So if you don’t think they’re open doors a competitor, then you probably shouldn’t think that those competitors, if you did think they’re open those competitors, I guess I’d like to know how, like, do you have billions of dollars? And again, their brokers who have started Ibai are at odds. Right. And I’m like, look, that’s great. But do those investors expect a return for their money? If the answer is yes, you’re not a competitor because neither Zillow nor Open Door their investors aren’t expecting a return. They’re expecting to lose money for a good long time. And they have real deep pockets and they don’t care because they’re all about kind of changing the world and, you know, that sort of thing.
So that’s how I’m looking at it. I understand there’s probably a different perspective on that, but I just want to hear the reasoning. Like I’m not saying I’m right and everyone’s wrong, but I just this how I think about it. I’m curious what other people think about it, too.
Eric Stegemann: So, I mean, I think, you know, we talked about this over the last time, too. I think that I buyers like open door. I definitely change the dynamics. And it could be and it’s yet to be seen. And I think it goes back to does it increase the number of transactions in the market? Right. So open doors, big push and statement has been we’re not negative towards brokers because we will increase liquidity. And when you any time in the history of time that you’ve increased liquidity in a capital market like real estate, you’ve seen all boats rise more.
And so from that perspective, if that’s really the case, if they’re increasing the number of total transactions and I texted Rob this earlier this week, that we’re actually on pace, that it’s six million transactions. That’s right near the top of any recorded year, maybe not the top or near the top of any recorded year that there’s been, then I think that could be the case. But, you know, if it isn’t, then it doesn’t. It seem like they’re taking transactions out, transaction sites out of the mix in terms of at least listings.
Rob Hahn: I suppose, you know, I suppose and I guess the secondary follow up question, though, is, are brokers really making is that really what a brokerage business is today? You know, and that’s what you and I talked about on the podcast. Right. Because if the idea is that brokerages are actually in the business of buying and selling homes, then yeah, but I don’t think brokerages are. I think brokerage today are in the business of recruiting and retaining agents.
Agents might be in the business of buying and selling homes, but then we get a whole other discussion, right? So from that standpoint, I’m not sure. And again, I would actually love to hear from brokers themselves, like how they see it, like, am I completely misinterpreting this? But so to your point, it’s like if they take out some of the transactions, that’s possible. So out of the, you know, 10 to 11 million or to your point, if it’s six million a year, it’s 12 million sides, you know, OpenDoor and Zillow going to take some percentage of it off the market, I guess.
I guess, you know, but to me, that’s sort of like that’s the world changing, you know.
Eric Stegemann: Like, so does that make them a threat? I suppose that’s one way to look at it, but this is a world changing and it’s just a matter of, OK, so how are we going to deal with it that consumer behavior is changing? You know, how do we deal with that? But do you think that the step that Zillow has made that already encroached upon something they said they would never do? Sure. Do you think that that’s a slippery slope? Do you I mean, in your post, you kind of say no, unless brokers force it right and or the world forces. Yeah, yeah. I think at so everybody should totally read. Rob’s most recent post called Don’t Forcillo into a Corner. Yeah, but do you think that’s really the case or do you think somebody at Zillow is sitting there thinking, hey, this is our first step into making everybody feel comfortable and it’s like putting the frog into the pot where you are growing up slowly instead of real fast.
Rob Hahn: Sure. And that’s obviously kind of been the the interpretation of the industry. And I saw it coming from I mean, when I first heard about this, like, really, you guys what that long ago when, like, Spencer was on stage swearing up and down that this would never happen. The problem is like. You know, it’s like if the world changes, the world changes, right? So what do you what are you supposed to do with that? The world has changed. Consumers want something else. Are you supposed to then say, screw that, hell with what the consumer wants? I’m not changing. Like, that’s idiotic. Like, nobody does that. Brokerage wouldn’t do that. So I just record a podcast with Greg Robertson this morning about it.
And the thing I pointed out was, you know, brokers are and MLS is and the whole industry is swearing up and down. You know, we are all about cooperation and compensation and that’s the pillar and so on. Well, here’s the thing. There’s a lawsuit going on right now to make that difficult or impossible to do away with commission sharing. If five years from now that lawsuit wins and the Supreme Court says you are no longer allowed to share commission or we going to say we don’t give a crap, we’re not going to change, of course we’re going to change.
The world has changed. We have to change. So that’s one part. The second part I’m saying, listen, the thing that I’m more concerned about is that we as an industry would do something just irrational and stupid, which then forces those guys into doing something that’s not good for anybody. It’s not making anybody any money. And yet we’re going to do it because they have to. Right. So maybe the way to think about it is this and this.
Just my interpretation of how to understand Zillow pivot. I actually think it really has to do with the fact that I’m saying we’re a market maker now, but we’re still you think of Zillow as an advertising vehicle and they sell leads to agents and that’s their business to me. When I look at what this pivot means, is that really kind of saying we’re no longer that we’re a market maker and I buy this. Our business going forward is buying homes for three hundred thousand and selling it for three hundred and three.
And in order to do that, they actually need to cut as much cost out of it as possible, and they have to make that process, that transaction experience better. And I think what they’re finding is open door had the lead on that. They had the edge because open door use their own in-house agents. So if I’m a seller, I say, hey, give me an offer. It’s one point of contact with Zillow. And this is what I said, right? It’s like, OK, I talk to somebody on Zillow and then I get handed off to some local agent and then that local agent maybe hands me off to people on their team. And it was very disjointed. So I think what they’re saying, OK, if our business is buying and selling homes, we need to improve that. We need to bring this in-house. The second part that follows, if we bring this in-house, we know that the Indians are going to cut off the data feed to us.
We know that for a fact. How do we get around that? Let’s join the MLS. Right. So it’s not I don’t know. I have trouble seeing it as like this evil conspiracy plan and all of that and slowly boiling the frog inside because, again, these guys are worth.
We know that for a fact, how do we get around that, let’s join the MLS, right. So it’s not I don’t know, I have trouble seeing it as like this evil conspiracy plan and all of that and slowly boiling the frog inside, because, again, these guys are worth twenty two billion. They have two billion in cash. Their stock is worth like ninety eight dollars a share, whatever. I mean, if these guys wanted to become brokers, if they wanted to, you know, really screw with the industry, then it’s not that hard for them.
Eric Stegemann: Right. That’s. It’s really easy, actually, and I think that’s what most brokers are sitting there worried and nervous about, is I think most of them recognize that Zillow has more or less won the consumers zero moment of truth to when they’re starting to search. At least Zillow owns the space of starting the home, the place where people start their search. Right. And they have they out a two hundred million unique views.
And all of this stuff that they have, and I think that’s where brokers are most nervous, is to say, look, if if if Zillow wanted to tomorrow, they could certainly get into the agent’s space. And if they discover, hey, I can go higher salaried based agents and I can go just hire one hundred agents and and kill it in the market and then have team members and assistants and things like that to process the transaction, I’m going to execute on their vision, which is to make the consumer process. That’s that’s what they care about right there. Consumer prices better, simpler. And what I think that makes brokers most nervous is less expensive. Right. So sure, you go use a Zillow agent to list your home and they could say, well, we’ll represent you to buy a home for free or something along those lines. You know, that’s that’s cutting out a chunk of commission out of that transaction would have happened that might have otherwise gone to a to a broker.
So I think the the bridge is not too far. The leap is quite small between point A and B. Whether they want to do it or not is a different question. But it would be very easy because they own the consumer in so many cases.
Rob Hahn: Sure, sure. But, you know, I think the way I look at that is, again, so I’m a I’m a strategy consultant for living my day job. So let’s just imagine that a broker is a client of mine. The first question I would be asking the broker is, how do you make your money? How do you make your money, because I know brokers at one hundred shops, so way they make their money is a monthly membership fee and a transaction fee. Right. So for those clients, one of the things I’ve said to them is we should not care about what the price of the home is because you don’t get paid on the on the value of the home. Right. You get paid on the transaction. So whether the agent is doing a hundred thousand dollars sale or a million dollar sale, you’re getting paid for ninety five. If that’s your business, then it changes everything that you should care about.
Right, if, on the other hand, you’re a, you know, 70, 30 split, then it’s a different thing. So the first question I think is as a brokerage, how do you make your money? And here’s what I do know. And we talked about this in a podcast. Most brokerages in North America are really struggling with profitability, right? Three percent right. On average, which means that half of them are below that. So then you could say, OK, where where you actually really making your profits? And it’s like, well, title, escarole, mortgage, et cetera. Well well, if that’s the case, then we’ve got to think about in those terms. Right. Why do you care about Zillow? Is this, that and the other thing? And, you know, if that’s your business, then you should do things to support your business, getting involved with all this stuff about home prices. And Commissioner Masek, why does it matter if you’re not making any money from it?
Eric Stegemann: This I think. Oh, doesn’t the money flow? What I mean by that is if you’re collecting four hundred dollars per transaction. Right. And there’s companies like Fathom Realty that are now free to companies that do exactly that. Yeah. And so when they have that, they still need the transaction to happen to begin with. Correct. But correct.
Rob Hahn: But they don’t need the commission amount to be whatever. Right. In other words, if the commission amount drops to one percent on average, but we still have 11 million transactions or 12 million transactions, that will be fine. They don’t care what the commission amount is. They just care about are their transactions happening and will my agents pay me? So that’s what I’m talking about. So it’s it’s hard to just kind of broadly say brokers should be paranoid about this. Brokers should be paid. I’m just saying. Well, tell me what your business is. Right. Because here’s the other thing. Red fin is a brokerage, right. But as you and I have talked about, I don’t actually look at Red fin as a brokerage. I look at them as a really big giant agent team. If you’re an agent team, then maybe you care more about it, because now your business is actually, you know, helping a consumer buy and sell homes and you’re taking a big chunk of the commission and then you’re actually splitting it out or you have W2 employees, so you have your expenses. That’s a different business model. And if that’s the case, I would think about things very differently, you know? So that’s the first point.
The second point, I think it’s like I said, having said all of that, it does seem clear to me that most brokerages in the industry today are in the recruiting and retention business. And if that’s true, then I think the question is Zillow now says they’re going to bring in buying and house. They are now going to join the MLS. My question is, how does that affect your recruiting and retention business? And as yet, I haven’t gotten a clear answer to that, so maybe you have a thought. I mean, how does that affect recruiting and retention, having buyers or.
Eric Stegemann: Yeah, OK is now in the MLS.
Rob Hahn: How does that affect the ability of Re/max results to recruit in Asia? Well, I will.
Eric Stegemann: We’re having Brendan on shortly, actually, and also in about 30 minutes. So you can you can ask her that question. Yeah, but I think, you know, I think I won’t speak for Brenda particularly, but when I will speak from is I think it is about recruiting retention. And if a broker can go to Zillow and have, you know, an even Redfin and salary plus commissions. Right. But if there’s a dwindling number of transactions that happen, even if you’re averaging a high number of transactions and Brenda’s company averages twenty three transactions per agent, per agent, and they have over 12 hundred agents. Right. And so, you know, from the the the proofing of your business, the Zillow proofing of your business, I think that’s about as strong as you could possibly get that’s out there. But I think at the same point, if I was sitting there and and I was the CEO of one of those types of companies, I would certainly look at it like there is likely to be a dwindling number of transactions. And every time my agents make less money, that means I can charge them less, whether that’s in a desk fee, a transaction fee, a month or whatever it happens to be. Also, any model that’s reliant on volume in terms of agents, you know, if you’re an XP realty and you’re, you know, getting everybody out there into the network and getting the transactions that go through, I think you’re going to dwindle over time if there’s more players in the market and there’s not more transactions because of that.
Rob Hahn: Right. Sure. Yeah, I mean, I see that I see kids so close up, it’s like if you’re a software company, a big software company I’m not talking about.
Or Apple, you’re also in the recruiting and retention business. I think if you ask a lot like Google, what they do now, it’s their product is pretty stable. It’s more like we just need good talent to keep building upon what we’re building on. And I think their big problem or their big concern that they have every day is making sure they’re getting the best talent possible to come work for them. But there’s more people drawing from that talent. There’s less to come to Google.
And if there’s more people drawing from the Minnesota Minneapolis real estate market of the top tier talent and Zillow says, hey, top agent, I’ll pay you five hundred grand a year salary to come work for me. And that way in a bad year, you’re even like you’re still going to make 500 grand a year. I think there’s going to be some agents that and teams maybe even that could go over there and do that. Now, I’m not saying Zillow is doing that, but I think it’s at least a consideration or if it was I was a CEO, it’d be something that would be sitting in the back of my brain.
Right. I guess I think the more the thing that I would be concerned about more, as you just said, OK, Zillow, an open door bringing a buyer in the house, which reduced the number of transactions that’s available to the more traditional route.
OK, if that’s a real concern, I guess my first question is, how big do you think this is going to get in your market? My buyers. Yeah, that market making transaction. How big do you think it’s going to get?
I believe I believe it will get to roughly 30 percent in major markets. So roughly 30 percent. So that’s the question. I think I as a CEO of a brokerage company, would I have to ask is how much do I want to spend to go after the 30 percent versus a 70 percent? Right, that that’s question number one, question number two is if it’s 30 percent and I’m like, I cannot surrender that, OK, go raise a bunch of money. Do I’m saying like we know how to do it? You’re saying what, and become an eye buyer? Yeah, I mean, if that’s a service you have to provide, because at the end of the day, it’s not about Zillow, it’s not about open door. It’s not about whoever it’s about. Is that a consumer need? Because by saying that it’s going to reach 30 percent of the market, what you’re saying is that 30 percent of home sellers want what those guys are offering. Right. So then you your job is to say, can I offer that to the consumer? Can my agents offer that to consumers?
Eric Stegemann: I, I totally agree with our clients. I have actually been having the conversation with them that I my advice to them is to go out and find funding, whether it’s loans or whatever. Yeah, it’s I mean to if you’re not focused on the entire United States, if you’re focused on individual market, you it’s not hard to get funding to be able to buy assets like homes.
Leader in the market, I think you’ll find banks and institutions that are willing to do that. I think the risk profile is very different from what the average CEO at a brokerage has been used to. And keep in mind, if you’re the market leader in a market, you’ve probably been that player and multigenerational, maybe businesses or at least a business that’s been there in that market for a long time, that’s been a very low risk business. Real estate is outside of every 10 or 15 years.
We get a recession. That’s your risk. But outside of it, generally, you have no outside risk, right? Rob Hahn: Right. And so from that perspective, this notches up your risk tenfold. Maybe one hundred fold, probably a thousand fold, you know, so that’s kind of my take on. It’s like if you really believe that. Now, here’s the thing. Most people think, like I buyers just a small niche. Then the question becomes, then why do you care so much about small niche? Right. Why don’t you focusing more on the ninety five percent focus on that. What are those, what are those consumers want. That’s probably a smarter use of your time and brainpower. Right, than worrying about the five percent. So a big part of this from my standpoint, Eric, because whenever it comes to Zillow, I started using the term Zatarain’s. I feel like some folks in the industry just kind of lose their minds. It’s like they can’t think straight.
They can’t see straight. It’s like, you know. Yeah, it’s like Zillow started selling coffee. I’m not drinking coffee anymore. I’m like, it’s like guys like if we just just look at it and look at it like how does it actually affect your business? I hear what you’re saying. Maybe if you’re in Phoenix, you know, this is a big thread’s, like 10 percent of the market, so on. So it’s like something you really have to watch. I guess my question is, all right, look, this is not what Zillow and Open Door have done, is they’ve proven that there’s a consumer demand for this type of thing.
If that concerns you, then it’s real simple. You either meet that consumer demand or you don’t write.
Eric Stegemann: It says I don’t if my if my estimation is correct that it could get to 30 percent of the market. And I actually believe that with correct data and correct financial management of the businesses, it could be much bigger than 30 percent if they can get their numbers down to what an average commission happens to be in a market. And if you look at markets like Phoenix, while there’s aberrations in the data, I’ve definitely seen numbers from companies like Open Door, where their average offer is like six and a half to seven and a half percent off the half the market value, which is competitive with a broker.
Rob Hahn: Right. So in those markets, if you if I never have to get my kids up early or make their beds or anything like that, you know, why wouldn’t I go to an I buyer? But they have to get their data models correct and they have to get their inventory turns grey. And that’s the biggest problem I think that Zillow has had is they’ve overpaid for properties much more so than open door and their inventory turn time is longer than what I think their expected return on cash has been. And that’s caused them to lose money per property instead of make money per property. Right.
Eric Stegemann: You’re assuming that they want to make money for property, right?
Well, I mean, you’re right that what I mean is if you start going into the mortgage business, which they have, they have more tech and they have a mortgage operation. If you go into the title business and all of those who cares if they lose fifteen hundred dollars in the house, which no broker, very few brokers can say, hey, I don’t care if I lose money and don’t make any money on the commission. Right. That no one can.
Rob Hahn: Yeah. So this is a big missing piece, right. Like I said, I mean, I think what folks are missing is that Zillow and Open Door are engaged in a giant market share grab. It’s very reminiscent of when, like the Internet came along. The very first time I remember like the dotcom, you know, first generation of companies that were just spending like crazy money just to get just to grow traffic patterns as a land grab.
Right. I mean, I feel like that’s how to think about it. It’s a land grab. Those two companies have investors and they have enough money and whatever that they don’t care about making a profit. Now, they don’t want to lose their shirt, but it’s not a huge focus for them. Everybody else is looking like this doesn’t make any sense. Of course, it doesn’t think it’s a land grab. So if you’re concerned about it, I’m saying that you have to get into the landgrab game.
Eric Stegemann: Agreed, agreed.
Rob Hahn: If you’re not interested in getting the landgrab game, my only point is where’s where where’s your real money coming from?
Eric Stegemann: Like, what is your revenue coming from? Is your profit actually coming from maybe spend more time thinking about that?
Rob Hahn: Because that’s all it. I think that’s very astute. If I was a broker, that’s what I would think it is. What’s my real business? What’s about and who’s my real competition? If you’re a Coldwell Banker, your real competition, I guarantee. It’s not Zillo, it’s EXPE, it’s, you know, it’s real to one group, it’s Keller, Williams, it’s those guys, or for that matter, it might be the small boutique down the road that just opened up, but they provide way better service. And you know what? It’s those guys not open door in Phoenix like. That that’s how I see it, so I’m just suggesting I think brokers have a tendency to kind of get distracted by, like, the latest shiny object.
Eric Stegemann: So, Rob, I’ve only got a couple of minutes left and I do have two other big questions that I want to ask you before we run out of time. Number one, what does a red fin versus Zillo end game Battle Royale look like?
Rob Hahn: I think the only way that happens is if social capital buys Redfearn and combine that with the open door. So that’s what that looks like, right. What’s your second question?
That’s a that’s an interesting thing. Then the next question is so Zillow Homes and part of Zillow corporate. And here’s my curveball. My my long term thinking, I think is nobody’s brought up yet. This was my thoughts last night. What should I ask Robert? What’s the what’s the thing? Eric Stegemann: Nobody’s really thought of in this. And maybe it’s not that big of a deal, but Zillo has this huge builder business, right? So they’ve gone after builders pretty heavily to make partnerships with them.
Yeah, and many brokerages have partnerships and make lots of.
Rob Hahn: I lost audio. Rob Reiner, can you hear me? Yeah. OK. Sorry, no builders brokerage’s. Yeah. Yeah.
Eric Stegemann: So, Mark, Mark’s a big, big way that they started climb was going after new home developments and condo buildings and things like that to get started at properties. That was their entire business to start the company in Chicago. So being at Zillow has.
Business to start the company in Chicago, so being a Zillow has all these partnerships with even national builders, do you think? Zillow Homes Partnership, do you think they go after these partnerships to be the in-house brokerage and say, hey, we’ll handle brokerage services for free if you put your inventory exclusively on Zillow? I don’t know, I mean, I have to ask them, but I think the better way of thinking about that is if I’m a new home builder, right. What is the value that Zillow can bring me versus what our properties can bring me?
Rob Hahn: I think that’s really the better way of thinking about not not about why don’t you answer your own. I think the answer there is because we’ve seen this already with builders working with open door. Open door actually has a much bigger lead in the new home construction thing. For them, the big appeal is that somebody walking in and saying, I want to buy this home, but it hasn’t been built yet. When’s it going to be built? It’s going to take nine months. OK, you know, I’m going to sell my house today, but I’m going to move in nine months. That’s a really appealing thing. Right. And that’s not open doors. It’s so if a broker can say, hey, listen, go buy from our new home construction partner, it’s going to take 90 days for that home to be built. But you can sell your house today and you don’t have to close for 90 days. If you can offer that, then, you know, it’s the same sort of value. Right. So I would say just think about what is in it, what’s in it for the new construction. And and again, to me, it’s like saying, well, it will do it for free. Like, that’s almost the wrong way of thinking about it. It’s more like what’s in it for the new construction. If they partner with an open door, with a Zillow, with whoever versus partnering with you.
Eric Stegemann: it’s to me Zillow has the eyeballs, right. No one sure. That a lot of places don’t have. So. And number two is that they they have the entire program so they can to be like Open Door has a partnership with Lennar. And I think you added one with D.R. Horton or something like that. Not long either. But Zillow has something that open or doesn’t have in the eyeballs. Nobody goes to opendoor.com to search for a home. But right now, 100 million people are going to search for a home. Right. So, you know, it seems to me like when it comes to the business space, there’s a huge lead that Zillow would have there, even beyond what anything like an app properties could possibly offer because of the eyeballs and say, hey, we’ll make you a featured thing and buy a new home and we’ll offer the buyer program to get them out of the house the day it closes. So they don’t have to worry about it right now. Any ideas? Right.
Rob Hahn: So if I if I’m at properties then my big thing would be, OK, well, I don’t have the eyeballs, I don’t have the money. So who does. Zillow does. Ah hey Zillow. Can I use your eyeballs. Can I use your money. Well, that’s going to be my next question, right?
Eric Stegemann: So I I think brokers that don’t want to go raise the money or don’t have the wherewithal to raise the money, they have to go make partnerships with companies like Open Door or somebody’s.
Rob Hahn: Yeah, yeah. All right. Or they can go together and then do a big conglomerate. I mean, there’s all sorts of fun things like I think everyone’s so terrified of what happened. I’m like, how about you stop being terrified to start thinking about what are some of the opportunities here? How does this end up maybe helping me? And I think maybe more of that thinking would be would be useful, but that’s just my take on it today. Twenty four hours after the Big Apple, for sure.
Eric Stegemann: OK, so last last very last question. Are we going to run? Because we’re already a couple of minutes. Are we going to send everybody to break? Is you know, you and I talked in the podcast, and so I’ll and I’ll just have everybody reiterate it for this one. What do you think is the biggest threat to a brokerage as it sits today?
Rob Hahn: The modern agent team right there, the ones eviscerating brokerage profitability, and they’re the ones who are taking all of the power and the value away from the brokerage.
So it’s a modern agent team because they go they can command because they control such a high volume of the transactions and correct that and they control their agents in a way that brokers simply can’t.
Eric Stegemann: All right. Well, we’ll leave it at that. I’ll remind everybody, I put in the chat to go and listen to the extended version of this conversation minus the Zillow about what is the biggest threat to broker brokerages in our podcast there. And make sure if you are not already a subscriber to notorious RB, its notorious-rob.com, I go in there and there is a free section, but I highly encourage you to go ahead and sign up for the notorious VIP, which is Rob’s paid section where he deep dives on topics like this one and more every single.
What is it, Rob? Every week or two weeks as often as I can. I mean, it’s I know I wish I should be much more regular, but. Yeah, but there’s a section here and it’s not very much what is said, Rob. Twenty dollars I think. Twenty bucks a month. Yeah. Nothing to get into this man’s brain. Twenty dollars a month. There you go. I appreciate that.
Rob Hahn: Thanks you. Yeah.